Hey Alex/Ryan,
I know we talked about redoing the animatic but; seeing as the feedback from the crit was positive on the original, the only negative was it's lack in sound. So, I've added a score and changed the ending with the alternate one we discussed.
Alex I know you are keen on adding a scene with the victim as a child, I still think we can include it in the collage at the end. This is by no means the final animatic. We can replace the scenes with people sitting down to jack in with the mobile ones, also imagine the flying car sequences with Ryan's futuristic car designs.
Personally I think we should run with what we have. I think the music makes it much, MUCH better and it says all we need to say.
P.S. Please excuse the awful American accent but you get the point... What do you think of it?
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ReplyDeleteThe music is nice but it doesnt go with the animatic 100%... I don't want to sound negative but there are couple things that im confused about
ReplyDeleteFirst off, i like the inception feel of the music but I thought we were going to have a jazz influence in the soundscape?
I think the pacing is off... the soft edits and fades do not work with this music at all atleast not throughout the trailer.. its like hard hitting drums to a snail crossing... its off.
This is our first attempt of the animatic
and we all came a decision on wednesday of the storyboard we were all happy with. I still think the animatic is too linear..
I know our pitch was good but we shouldn't have to settle just because Alan liked it. We could push this even further, but I'm not comfortable with settling for the first idea.
The one we came up with showcases a better use of editing slicing of the story, its more cinematic, and more sci fi in terms of the editing the scenes. EG the flashy eye.
there's something about the second of theanimatic we stays flat, and doesnt progress in speed and story.
I'm know your not convinced so im going to put together the storyboard spend time coming up with on Wednesday and we can compare.. it will be up tonight. I know that everyone liked it at our pitch but we can and should push it to a really high end industry standard, I honestly believe we can make this 10 times stronger than what it is now.
I literally want this to be frigging EPIC! and it will ;)
Hi Alex,
ReplyDeleteI hear what you're saying but I don't agree with everything you've said. Don't want to sound negative either I'm saying this intending it to be purely discursive.
I know jazz music was briefly discussed but I spent absolutely ages trying to find a score for this. This one, I think works really well. It helps to establish the environment and gradually increases in tempo when the detective is confronted with a situation (receiving the anonymous call, new job, files on the girl etc). Tempo drops back again as new environment(s) are established (Old Broadway, Theatre etc). It then goes stratospheric as it climaxes. I think it needs to gather pace and raise excitement. I don't think it's off at all. I think it fits. I don't think it gets more cinematic?!
I know you are worried about it being too linear, but I'm having a tough time thinking of a non-linear trailer. Can you give me an example? Just because our trailer is linear narratively speaking, doesn't mean our film is. For example; Christopher Nolan's film "Memento" is perhaps the most non-linear film I can think of. I don't know if you've seen it? Without spoiling it, the films edited together backwards, with fractured time lines thrown in to boot. Non-linear film, but every trailer for it is narratively linear. Visually speaking, I think our trailer is non-linear, the establishing shot of New York could be halfway through the film. People jacking into the virtual worlds could be at the start of the film? The film could start with the victim establishing her new life as a play writer before the detective is even assigned the case. Ok, we end our trailer with the proposed ending of the film, but the audience doesn't find out what happens to her... or the events leading up to it. Like the "Minority Report" trailer I told you about. It establishes the premise of the film; it doesn't mention Tom Cruise's characters motivations for working for the pre-crime unit; or explain why the "pre-cogs" can see the future.
I'm still concerned about people walking around watching / using the GUI's. I don't think it would happen. People would walk into stuff. Glasses have been invented that project an image on the inside of the lens. It didn't take off because it didn't work. People walked into stuff! I'm not saying scrap Ryan's concepts, but would people walk around watching / experiencing films etc? I can watch films on my iPhone and I don't walk around watching them. Plus with the proposed changes to the animatic, eg close up of multiple cars zooming around, close up shots of crowds of people using GUI's, dream sequence of little girl playing, I'm worried we won't be able to make all of this. We have to be realistic. The new structure has everything in this trailer (edited in a different order), plus more on top!
I know this is our first attempt at an animatic, but that doesn't mean it's not right. If Alan is our client, our objective is to make him and the audience happy. We got the green light! I'm not saying this is perfect, of course it needs tweaking and refining but we don't need to redo it all. I agree we can make this epic.
That said if you want to make an animatic, go for it. Ryan what are your thoughts? I personally think we should start with post production with what we have. Really don't want to tread on anyone's toes but this is what I think...
In regards to the GUI's its like using phones. People don't walk into stuff when they are on the phone, so I don't get your point. We actually talked about it, I never said they would be walking and looking at the screen. We said that they would be at a train station or something and multiple people would be using it.. Like you see people using phones, so i really don't see the problem is with that.... I just don't like the second half of the animatic, i think its too flat, but we'll leave it to majority..I'll make my animatic tonight and we will compare
ReplyDeleteHey hey hey! :)
ReplyDeleteI honestly like the linearity of it Paul. Establishes environment. establises the hero. the plot device. It's crystal clear about our story, and it does well to ramp up the pacing towards the end. Few picky things I wanna add:
The transition at 0:38 between New York and Old Broadway seems odd to me, because there's no explaination of why he's going there. We need to say something visually or within the narration that bridges or gives a reason why he's going to Old Broadway from the previous scene.
I know you said the other day that in the animatic some parts of this was simply represnetitive so I won't go into detail about this- but the scene that establishes the public's GUI at 0:44 definately needs to be swapped for another scene.
Also what was the sound effect in that quick cut on the detective at 1:19? :D
In regards to music-
I really liked the 'epic' type of music we have currently in the animatic, it does make the animatic feel so much better and it's pacing does fit.
However, my problem is with it's unoriginality. - If you check out the trailers for Inception, Battlefield 3, The Dark Knight, they all use essencially the same theme of music to ramp up its pacing, but that's all it conveys. I feel the music provides nothing towards the atmosphere of our world and that may deduct us in originality/creativity in sound.
If you were thinking of a Jazzy feel Alex, I can think of music maybe similar to Parov Stelar or Kilimanjaro Darkjazz Ensemble: Tranquil beats.. or for more of an electronic-jazzy feel: Hird If were going for the Edward Hopper-ish atmosphere this theme of music would fit.
I would really love a best of both worlds if it's posssible- Conveying the atmosphere/theme of our world whilst also ramping the pacing/tempo that Paul currently has in the animatic.
Maybe push out a few animatics with different music choices to see which one is best?
Tom Beg posted a link on the group blog to the Vimeo Music Store which has some royalty-free music, so it might be worth checking that out.
In regards to the GUIs (Gonna assume we're gonna call it that from now on). There's 2 ways we can approach this:-
Either the public uses it like how we use mobile phones today- It's used 'at will' rather than always on. Like something one can use whilst on the train.
Or.
I can modify the design of the GUI so that instead it would be more similar to designs like 'Cross-Com' or 'What the US Military is playing around with'.
This way, the GUI displays elements like the clock, tv etc on the edges of the users' sight rather than obstruct the users view. That way people will be able to see whilst the elements are still there on the edges.
Hey guy's,
ReplyDeleteGlad we are "all" discussing this. What I'm trying to say about the GUI's is this; I know people can walk and around using their phones, but that's usually with the phone up to their ear. How many people do you see walking around watching films as they're going down the street? If our GUI's immerse people in virtual worlds, I don't think people would be walking around in reality too. I'm not saying get rid of them, I'm just saying we have to think logically about it. I like Ryan's suggestion with the "cross-com", stuff around the edges etc. When people want to get fully immersed they let their entire vision get taken over. I think people should have voluntary control, but when our victim is hacking them they don't. I agree we need to swap the GUI scenes in my animatic, get rid of the goggles / helmet thing etc. Like I said it is representative. How do we convey the public "plugging" in with the GUI format just discussed?
To answer your questions Ryan, we can explain why the detective goes to old broadway (and that transition) in the case file. When it's zooming in on her face we can have details of her last known location and place of work on the detectives screen? The sound effect on the quick cut on the detective was a gun shot made to sound like a phazer blast, lol. Would they have guns in the future? That quick cut is meant to be a snap shot of a chase scene (or something like that) from the film.
I really like the music suggestions you put up here Ryan. I definitely think it can be incorporated. I still like the idea of having a jazzy theme at the beginning. I used the inception music because I couldn't find anything else and thought it worked? This isn't the final rendition! I definitely think it needs to build in tempo to the climatic ending. I don't think the second half of the animatic is flat at all!?
Alex, when you've done your animatic let's sit down all together and compare. At the end of the day all of the scenes from this animatic are in the revised version. Just re-organised. Essentially we are removing the text and filling it with more scenes. I.e train station or public area, more flying cars, more characters (a crowd of people using GUI's, girl in sequence, extended theatre scene with villain) and a car chase scene. On top of this we have to build and rig an entire city, interior of theatre, Old Broadway, our detective, his car, his office, the victim, rooftop scene etc. There's A LOT to do here and I'm worried we're adding to much! When we sit down and discuss I think we should indicate what will be made in maya; what scenes will have matte painted backgrounds; after effects shots etc, so we get more of an idea what we have to do and how to manage our time and expectations.
lets make this clear ...no one is going to be walking around with the GUI'S!!! !its like when people use Ipad's exactly the same thing... there is nothing wrong with the GUI's seriously there isnt, your going to see people using for like one scene anyway! your thinking too deep into this, its just the trailer, not the logic of the film
ReplyDeleteyou guys when I compared the GUI's to the phones, it was in the way that people look at the screens to text or go on the internet... No one is going to be watching a movie while walking! they would be stationary.. I can't stress this enough because we talked about this last week wednsday.. The exact same thing! and its really insufficient when Paul's trailer and mine feature it for one single scene!
ReplyDeletePlothole I guess (something I'd see Daniel bringing up during crit day :P ), It would undermine the logic of our world, of the plot and of the backstory.
ReplyDeleteThe important aspect was the victim exploiting the GUIs as her ability, as the GUIs are connected to a persons' mind.
To me the idea was that everyone uses it as a social normality, you carry it like a credit card or a phone. I would say don't restrict it to entertainment purposes: the GUI's could perform a number of things, Calendars for appointments, Global Positioning Systems, calls, web, texts, video chat over Skype, Chatroulette.. etc.
You could have varying levels of immersion, some people want to call others over it whilst walking around, others would be watching a film in full view while on the train.
I'd say in the trailer have them on with people walking around paying half attention to it? same thing if we have a train scene.
Stop thinking so much into this you guys.. your hanging up over somethingthat won't be shown for 5 seconds. I feel like i'm nagging, but seriously lets move on from this. Literally people with the device on their heads.. Done. Its DONE. Lets just concentrate on the animatic now
ReplyDeletelove this! :)
ReplyDelete